Cjelex: It feels very strange for the Haranir, a group introduced as being incredibly xenophobic and reclusive that would banish one of their people for simply revealing themselves to an outsider, to be used as the "voice of reason" saying that we're all connected and should just be friends with each other. It really feels like no aspect of what they're meant to do has ever been decided beyond pushing the plot forward.

Wolvenpact: I'm glad that all racial representatives respond with "Okay and? I still hate all those others and want nothing to do with them."

It just raises the question: What even is the purpose of this "reveal"?

PS: Playable Revantusk Trolls and Stonemaul Ogres for the Horde, please. They were chronologically the second and third races to join the Horde.

istnuk1994: I just want to point out that it is referenced more times than in legion. Both in game and out of game, sorry for the long post.

In vanilla in the pvp alterac valley quests the darkspear questgiver say that the night elves came from trolls but that they're denying this heritage.

The night elf quest giver in alterac valley send you to kill trolls on order of Fandral because of the slander that trolls claim to be their origin.

and the in game readable lore book "Twin-empires" while not entirely correct with current lore at least as we know the night elves came from dark trolls, claim that a group of trolls broke off the amani empire and settled near the well of eternity and became night elves. But this can be seen as a in universe belief by some I'd say.

On the old wow website on the lore pages titled "Troll compendium" it is said that it's a widespread belief among trolls that they birthed night elves. And that the night elves refute this belief.

During cataclysm in the official wow magazine we see Brann bronzebeard claim that the night elves come from dark trolls and that he is worried that it will ruffle some feathers, he said he confirmed this by asking Freya and Cenarius directly.

And in the second ask Cdev thread on the forums one of the questions was if the night elves was related to trolls and the answer was to check said magazine since the answer was there.

Then, of course, we have chronicle that mention it as well, but this is supposedly written from some sort of titan or titan minion PoV.

Then in legion we had the trolling quest as you showcased in this video, but we also had an grey robe item called Crumbling Ceremonial Vestments which flavour text mentioned it having both the symbols of loa and of elune, pointing to it being from the time when the ancestor of night elves moving from loa worship to elune worship.

Then in dragonflight we had the dragonflight codex book, which was in lore written by Khadgar, and he claims that the night elves came from the dark trolls as well. Although he also mentions he has access to the libraries of Kharazan, Dalaran and the dragon isles for composing this book.

But in short, we've had mentions in-universe of trolls being the ancestors of night elves since 2005, that's 21 years. We've had more mentions of this than we have of vrykuls being the ancestors of humans!

v6SK-IC5: Haranir in the lore: extremely xenophobic, loves to hide, an ancient but clueless race.

Haranir in game: “We’re all one people, please everybody come to my home. We have all the answers.”

jaychuckleton: It honestly would have been better if the Trolls were the original race and the haranir evolved from them and not the other way around.

gomatgo: This could all have been avoided if the Haranir were just the dark trolls.

noteworthynerd1337: I haven't kept up with retail community since Legion, but I also thought it was pretty well known that Night Elves are descended from Trolls who were influenced by the Well of Eternity... Another great video!

Altrantis: I really want a scene where a dwarf character is there while the elves and trolls are talking about how it can't be, they can't be related, and the dwarf is like "Seriously? Could 'ave fooled me. Ye all look alike ta me. Would have been strange if you weren't related. Next you'll tell me you never suspected some sort of link between dwarves, gnomes and humans."

fetteranton: THANK YOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOU I thought I was taking crazy pills with how everyone was reacting to this revelation. I thought this was obvious from just reading the basic quests texts and doing a little bit of the artifact questline in Harandar.

seanconnell7231: There is like one quest at the end of the weekly chain to get the haranir decor relic where they say they never left harandar because they werent strong enough to find the goddess, and now they have allies who are very powerful they might be able to go find her. In that context the story makes more sense in that the haranir are trying to get their allies on their side to later use their strength to go find Azeroth.

dragovianknight: I know Blizz already said no, but I still yearn to discover that the "goddess" they followed was Y'shaarj. That would be the best bait and switch ever.

AllyourBase3: everything about the Haranir just sucks

SegFaults-p7y: 0:33 it's wild because in legion during the Suramar campaign the Blood Elves literally remind the Night Elves that they are descended from trolls? Was that quest just a meta joke?? If so can we even trust any main story quest anymore? The reveal does make sense, but I think it would have been better received if the Haranir were the link between trolls and elves and not some precursor species.

wuzittooya: Haranir would've definitely been more acceptable to me without shoehorning them into something already established.

sdnw1840: I still think they should've been quillboar that were transformed by the Well of Eternity. THEY HAVE THORNS! We could have had pig noses!

benjaminehren7965: My big issue is how human the haranir look. And by human I really mean titan.

Humans look human on Azeroth because they are titan robots made flesh, just like dwarves and gnomes, and the idea elves look more human due to being mutated by order magic making them look more like titans and thus more human is the coolest bit of lore the game has ever had. So why do haranir, supposedly less titan influenced than elves, have such human appearances compared to trolls.

FellishBeast: An elf-troll is what you’d expect to the Dark Trolls to turn into as they transition to being Night Elves. It doesn’t make sense for the ancestor of trolls and elves to be an elf-troll. That would mean the elf-trolls evolved into full trolls and then into elves. The elf-ification of trolls was caused by the Well of Eternity.

The Haranir appear to be mid-transition between troll and elf, implying they live in close proximity to the Well and are turning into elves.

davidb3155: Zul Jan is not the villain. Blizzard is for this shitty writing. This whole haranir story is just summed as "hey stop fighting, you were all monkies once upon a time. We are all the same"

SwabcraftCreates: Didn't come out during the sundering, the cataclysm, didn't come out during the sword, didn't come out during shadowlands targeting the soul of Azeroth. Didn't come out during the third war and that massive trail of blight going through eversong woods. It mostly evidence that the current writers don't care about the lore.

wavetactics13: Naw, it doesn't make sense. The transition from dark troll to night elf makes sense that exposure to Azeroth the titan would mutate trolls into a more titan-like appearance. With the high elves continuing the mutations via the sunwell to the point they fit in easily with humans, dwarves, and other titan creations. Haranir to troll makes no sense, however. And trolls being established as the ancient race that diverged long before the night elves appeared raises the question why one group of Haranir rapidly evolved and the other took much longer to change and went unnoticed all the while.

The only explanation that fits with years of lore is the Haranir being the midpoint between dark troll and night elf. Some of whom must have gone underground as they say they did and stopped mutating into night elves. Them thinking they're the ancestor race ought to be them jumping to conclusions after seeing trolls and elves for the first, but I don't know if Blizzard's writers are pulling a bait and switch or if it's an actual retcon of the trolls' origin.

gwen5495: This scene made me so angry. Shandris and Thalyssra are old enough to remember the well of eternity changing trolls into elves. Yet they stand there with Pikachu faces for Hagar's reveal. Give me a fking break blizz

CesarDraigcyfail: I think Blizz biggest flaw right now is the lack of reasoning for things to happen when looking at WoW as a whole and not just the expansion.

If all Elf Types, Haranir and Trolls followed "The Song of the World" and took a seedling they just found at the base of Shalandrill and with combined efforts they take it to Teldrassil to plant it and that gives them the vision of their ancestor protecting the original roots and realizing they are one and the same despite their physical & spiritual differences it might've felt smoother but Blizz can't help themselves but make the biggest thing in a certain direction: Jailer is the biggest villain ever, Haranir are the oldest race ever, the old gods are the most evil ever, etc.

I feel like they lost their ability to use nuance.

sam_hek: I think you hit the nail on the head, it just feels like the jailor writing all over 'this is the most oldest most important thats always been here forever' So even if its not a true retcon, it's written in a way that feels like it again.

HammerForge.cosplay: 2 things: I would have bought this no problem if Haranir came AFTER trolls. So troll -> haranir -> elves.

It also bothers me alot that troll tusks are on the upper jaw and Haranir on their lower jaw.

ollorin5953: A great take, 100% agree. There is 0 need to bring in new shiny stuff that no one cares about & develop that so that they can stomp all over & never develop the established stuff people do care for.

Current playable races get 0 love. I originally played WoW because of Taurens. Watching a friend play, I saw Thunder bluff. The music, the vibe, the culture - that's when I bought the game. I have loved their culture & lore ever since. I loved seeing their settlements in Stone Talon Mountains, Desolace, Thousand Needles, Feralas. Sadly I can't remember the last time I saw a Tauren settlement anywhere or had a good Tauren story arc. Taunka, Youngul, Highmountain - but not a single Tauren settlement since Vanilla despite being a core race. Surely where we land in a new zone, we'd throw up some teepees & a totem or two?! I set my hearth to Thunder bluff even although its inconvenient because its the only way to get some Tauren in the game.

Wanted races are ignored entirely. People say it's too hard for blizzard to do transmog and animations for new races like Ogres etc. They've had 20 years and a lot of money. I say they can figure it out. I grinded my Timbermaw rep 20 years ago - my exalted pals where are you?

The story is again disrespecting their audience and their own lore history. Not even going into the friendship love circle & what they are doing to Zul'jan

It makes me sad, feels like WoW writers / devs really don't care about or know their game as well as the players.

Regnier191: Aww, were all just one big happy family. Why can't we all just hold hands, sing songs and get along? fucking barf. There's no WAR in WARcraft anymore.

tmanook: I don't dislike the Haranir. I don't care for them either. They feel... out of place. /shrug

Jul 17 2026

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